Shipbucket

I have done a lot of drawings based on the British Hawkins class cruiser hull. The Hawkins class was built to counter German raiders on the high seas. So I put my German hat on and tried to figure out what a Medium sized cruiser could look like with a completion date expected to be 1918-19. As normal with a raider the ship would have to be able to defeat the normal escort that might be guarding a convoy on the high seas. These would generally be light cruisers of the Town type or older armoured cruisers (County type) that would have the range.

I ended up with a 500 foot cruiser armed with 8 x 170mm. The German 170mm was better than the British 6" and 7.5" that would arm the escort cruisers listed above. The 170mm gun and turrets were already available on the older pre-dreadnought battleships which could have been used to speed up production to get the ships to sea if the type had been proceeded with.



Displacement: 7,800 tons normal, 10,750 tons full load
Dimensions: 511 x 56 x 23 feet
Machinery: 2 shaft, turbines, 60,000shp
Speed: 30 knots
Endurance: 12,000 nmi at 12 knots
Armour: 4.1" belt, 2" deck, 2.75" turrets
Armament:
8 x 6.7" (170mm) (4x2)
6 x 88mm (6x1)
Torpedoes: 8 x 19.7" (500mm) (4x2)
Crew: 580

I like this very much.
I remember doing a pencil sketch of a possible 1920s German Hawkins equivalent and it looked pretty much like this.

_________________
Hood's Worklist
English Electric Canberra FD
Interwar RN Capital Ships
Super-Darings
Never-Were British Aircraft

The only thing I would do, is making the bridge window smaller and not angled, for at the moment it look like it have got an modern bridge on a old ship...I find that a little out of place.

I'm sure that rendition of the Admiral Schroder is first class Kraky my old china, but I'd just like to comment on that badge of yours...

May I congratulate you sir, on that totally FANTASTICLLY AWESOME badge of yours old chap

Jolly well drawn Krakatoa old man. WELL DONE sir

WELL DONE indeed

_________________
https://discord.gg/5PHq8Dk
My artwork is posted here: https://www.deviantart.com/adenandy/gallery/all

Thanks for the comments gentleman.

Heuhen: that is part of the bridge structure of the design for the 1921 Emden. It may look modern, but is not really.

Adenandy: thanks for the praise on the badge. Only thing I was not certain about was putting it inside one of the 'rope' shapes. Being German should it have the sides plain?

Hood: I have always liked the idea of the Hawkins with its 7.5" but the execution of the design was always poor with the hand operated single 7.5". Twin turrets had been in use on cruisers for 15+ years so why they were not carried onto the Hawkins beats me. Hawkins with power operated twin turrets would have given my Admiral Schroder a 'mutually assured destruction' type battle.

I guess in theory, regretfully, custom would have it with plain sides, but without seeing an original Illustration, I really couldn't say old chap.

But in that rope boarder, it really is most pleasing on the eye

I'm sorry I can't be of any more help on this occasion old man.

With Kind Regards,

Andy

_________________
https://discord.gg/5PHq8Dk
My artwork is posted here: https://www.deviantart.com/adenandy/gallery/all

Hi Krakatoa!

My guess would be that people were reluctant to leave large holes for turret barbettes in the decks of light cruisers, who had less structural integrity to work with than an armoured cruiser or a battleship. Light cruisers of the size of HMS Hawkins were a total novelty in their time, after all; the next biggest ones (the Russian Admirals) were nearly 4.000 tons smaller. Probably it took some time to realize that Hawkins' hull would have been plenty big enough for barbettes. With the Germans and their in-bred conservatism in design matters, it would certainly have taken even longer.

BTW, the 170mm turrets on the Braunschweigs were singles; twin turrets were only used for 210mm and larger pieces on armoured cruisers. Although a 170mm twin for cruisers seems a logical choice logistics-wise (the 170mm-armed battleships did not see combat very often, and you could use up lots of stockpiled ammunition), there was none in the inventory and would have to be developed anew. Same for the guns themselves; there was no newer model than the 170mm L/40 of 1904 vintage, which fired a shell of 64 kg at a ROF of 6 - 7 rpm to a range of 17.000m at 30° elevation. Compared with the British 190mm L/45 Mk.VI on the Hawkins (90kg shell, ROF 5 - 6 rpm, range 19.000m at 30°), that gun was at a distinct disadvantage; a newer L/45 design would have at least provided competitive range and superior ROF.

Apart from that, neat drawing.

Greetings
GD

The only way to improve the Schroder to give it an edge over the Hawkins (from GD's stats) would be to increase the gun size to 8.2" and reduce the number from 8 to 6.

Which gives:




I have never liked having a six main gun armament. Obtaining hits in six gun salvo fire is much less (25-30% less depending on which way you work it) than even an eight gun salvo. But to increase the broadside to eight guns from six requires quite a jump in size from the Tirpitz up to something like an Improved superfiring Blucher (see Manteufel thread) (((or the later Argentinian 8x8" cruiser I drew in a Germanic style. removed)))

As you can see above. I have increased the dimensions, again, of the Admiral Class to enable a fourth 8.2" turret.

The 8x170mm version is 511 x 56.
The 6x210mm version is 523 x 58
The 8x210mm version is 557 x 61

Speeds vary from 31 knots at light displacement through to 29 knots at full load displacement. 30 knots is an average speed in normal conditions.

The 8x2 210mm version looks good, would be a good prototype for what became the Washington cruiser.
These make a nice comparison to the Atlantic Cruisers I drew some time back, those were never-weres of 1912-13, had they been built instead of the Hawkins as we know them, then something like this would have been very likely to have been on the drawing boards by 1918.

_________________
Hood's Worklist
English Electric Canberra FD
Interwar RN Capital Ships
Super-Darings
Never-Were British Aircraft